Rick Ranck
asked on
Sending to Yahoo Email Issues
My email issues are continuing, but only with domains hosted by Yahoo. My Spf record is correct and I have fixed my ptr record today as well (Finally in place around noon). Here are my DNS Records and a screen shot of the issue. This issue is only occurring with Yahoo.com email addresses or domains hosted by Yahoo. Everything else works as expected.
PTR.jpg
DNS.jpg
Error.jpg
PTR.jpg
DNS.jpg
Error.jpg
Do note that even after the specific problem is cleared up, it will take some time for Yahoo to clear you from their own internal blacklist.
ASKER
Saif,
I've filled out that form twice and gotten no response other than automated emails that after the 3rd response, closes the request saying that it's been longer than 5 days since the last activity on the ticket..
I've filled out that form twice and gotten no response other than automated emails that after the 3rd response, closes the request saying that it's been longer than 5 days since the last activity on the ticket..
ASKER
Dr. Klahn,
How long does this typically take to happen for Yahoo? Once the PTR record was fixed earlier email went out to a vast majority of what was in queue. Does it typically take longer for them?
How long does this typically take to happen for Yahoo? Once the PTR record was fixed earlier email went out to a vast majority of what was in queue. Does it typically take longer for them?
may be the PTR update which happened (Finally in place around noon) has to be updated in global DNS and that what is taking time I think..
No way to guess with obfuscated data.
Tip: Most people fail to understand how Oath (owns all Yahoo + AOL email addresses now) handle mail.
Here's a summary.
1) If you send any mail to an Oath recipient, with an email from the recipient first you are a spammer.
In other words, if you send to Oath without Oath first sending to you, you're a spammer. Period. No exception. This is the literal definition of spam, which is unsolicited email.
2) This means any opt-in captures which send a double opt-in message, is spam. 100% spam, in all cases, no exception.
3) The only way to get good deliverability from Oath is to force recipients to email you first.
4) This means rather than having any opt-in boxes + sending double opt-in mail, you can't do this with Oath.
You must present a page with an email address, like join@mysupergreatproject.c
5) Another consideration. Oath provides a specific SMTP banner response... I forget exactly the text, as I've had this logic baked into all my MTAs for years.
The Oath TOS says, "If you get this SMTP response, you must wait 4 hours before sending an email from the IP receiving this message."
If you violate this obscure requirement + keep trying to send mail, which means using normal SMTP backoff, then you'll first be blacklisted inside Oath, then if you do this long enough (for example, with a large list) then they will add you to every RBL under the sun + you'll be out of business.
Managing deliverability to Oath properties is super complex. Sending mail to Oath requires custom MTA code, in most cases. If you send mail to Oath incorrectly you will eventually end up with all your sending IPs + domain all blacklisted.
Tip: Till you get all this worked out, best to segment your list so all Oath addresses are handled completely differently than other addresses.
Tip: Having correct PTR, SPF, DKIM is insufficient for Oath deliverability. You must create a circumstance for Oath addresses to always mail you first.
Tip: Most people fail to understand how Oath (owns all Yahoo + AOL email addresses now) handle mail.
Here's a summary.
1) If you send any mail to an Oath recipient, with an email from the recipient first you are a spammer.
In other words, if you send to Oath without Oath first sending to you, you're a spammer. Period. No exception. This is the literal definition of spam, which is unsolicited email.
2) This means any opt-in captures which send a double opt-in message, is spam. 100% spam, in all cases, no exception.
3) The only way to get good deliverability from Oath is to force recipients to email you first.
4) This means rather than having any opt-in boxes + sending double opt-in mail, you can't do this with Oath.
You must present a page with an email address, like join@mysupergreatproject.c
5) Another consideration. Oath provides a specific SMTP banner response... I forget exactly the text, as I've had this logic baked into all my MTAs for years.
The Oath TOS says, "If you get this SMTP response, you must wait 4 hours before sending an email from the IP receiving this message."
If you violate this obscure requirement + keep trying to send mail, which means using normal SMTP backoff, then you'll first be blacklisted inside Oath, then if you do this long enough (for example, with a large list) then they will add you to every RBL under the sun + you'll be out of business.
Managing deliverability to Oath properties is super complex. Sending mail to Oath requires custom MTA code, in most cases. If you send mail to Oath incorrectly you will eventually end up with all your sending IPs + domain all blacklisted.
Tip: Till you get all this worked out, best to segment your list so all Oath addresses are handled completely differently than other addresses.
Tip: Having correct PTR, SPF, DKIM is insufficient for Oath deliverability. You must create a circumstance for Oath addresses to always mail you first.
ASKER
This isn't bulk mail... This is literally people trying to send an email to yahoo.
@David - For your point #1, I think you meant "without" (instead of "with").
"People sending to Yahoo" == Spam.
Unless the recipient (people at Yahoo) first sent an email to someone outside of Yahoo.
In other words, if john@foo.com sends a message to dodad@yahoo.com, without dodad@yahoo.com first sending a message to john@foo.com then Oath considers this spam (unsolicited email).
You can make up stories in your head about this being incorrect + you have to think in terms of Oath as a brain dead Bot, because it is a brain dead Bot.
All a brain dead Bot can do is a simple check of all incoming mail from john@foo.com sent to dodad@yahoo.com + consider whether dodad@yahoo.com started a conversation or not. If not, then john@foo.com + all IPs sending for foo.com + the domain foo.com are all considered spammers.
Unless the recipient (people at Yahoo) first sent an email to someone outside of Yahoo.
In other words, if john@foo.com sends a message to dodad@yahoo.com, without dodad@yahoo.com first sending a message to john@foo.com then Oath considers this spam (unsolicited email).
You can make up stories in your head about this being incorrect + you have to think in terms of Oath as a brain dead Bot, because it is a brain dead Bot.
All a brain dead Bot can do is a simple check of all incoming mail from john@foo.com sent to dodad@yahoo.com + consider whether dodad@yahoo.com started a conversation or not. If not, then john@foo.com + all IPs sending for foo.com + the domain foo.com are all considered spammers.
Bulk Mail or Transactional Mail.
If you send first (no initial email from Oath) you are a spammer, per Oath's brain dead Bot logic.
If you send first (no initial email from Oath) you are a spammer, per Oath's brain dead Bot logic.
ASKER CERTIFIED SOLUTION
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Make sure that:
Reverse DNS resolves to a hostname.
Make sure the hostname has a A record.
Don’t use generic hostnames assigned by ISPs or server vendors.
SPF is valid.
DKIM is working properly.
Yahoo uses Spamhaus.
I verified your public IP 208.255.189.187 and domain homeparamount.com are not blacklisted.
Blocklist Lookup Results
208.255.189.187 is not listed in the SBL
208.255.189.187 is not listed in the PBL
208.255.189.187 is not listed in the XBL
Blocklist Lookup Results
homeparamount.com is not listed in the DBL
Fill out the Yahoo Bulk Sender Form: https://io.help.yahoo.com/contact/index?y=PROD_POST&page=contactform&locale=en_US&token=Zh/BBVqXzLHlIbokbUqVWTUbuuQeXGkGnZzhKR2JQ4O6mMQdy9JSWdtWFXvjthcYCRj9bUIFfycOfG+4GOHPHoOGa8HwDO2+0kYRtTcdR8NsLD0dGURpc1B0MBKcI2o/o/mRH4O42kz3lgqmGuc8ri0k6+CMt1UY&selectedChannel=email-icon&yid=
Even if you are not a bulk sender, you will need to complete the Yahoo! Bulk Sender Form.
Though some fields on the delivery report are optional, it is best to provide as much information as possible. Especially, the “Enter additional information here:”.
You will want to detail in 2-3 sentences your remediation efforts.